RE: america

Sean Draine (seandr@Exchange.Microsoft.com)
Tue, 30 Mar 1999 17:25:20 -0800 

The parallel that I see between Vietnam and Kosovo is that we entered both
conflicts with the assumption that our advanced technology would allow us to
easily overwhelm the opponent while spilling a minimum of American blood.
Bad assumption in the case of Vietnam. Possibly a bad assumption in the case
of Kosovo - that remains to be seen. Keep in mind, the Serbs, like the North
Vietnamese, are strongly united in their cause. 

Jim, if you'll reread my post, you'll note that I've not taken a position on
the moral justification of Kosovo. Nevertheless, you've somehow
misattributed an opinion to me. If you're going to drag me into that debate,
you should know that I didn't find Scottie's analogies with the American
Civil War or WWII very convincing, nor was I convinced by your equation of
Serbs with Nazis. For my view, take the average of yours and Scottie's
opionion and divide by the square-root of three.

-Sean

"Take that out of your mouth this very instant!"
	- Gloria Farbschmertz

-----Original Message-----
From: blah b b blah [mailto:jrovira@juno.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 1999 3:06 PM
To: bananafish@lists.nyu.edu
Subject: Re: america


Foreign policy, like economics, needs to be treated on a case by case
basis.  This has nothing to do with the stupidity of Technological
Supremacy  or Omnipotence.  It has to do with the situation at hand and,
as Americans, what is best for ourselves and our allies and then the rest
of the world.  

Those are the priorities I set for myself and expect my leaders to share.

The stability of the Middle East is in everyone's best interests.  The
Gulf war was a good idea, and Bush's success in gaining international
support prior to commencing full scale attacks is kinda the proof of
that.  I question the motive and timing of Clinton's more recent attacks.

Given that genocide really is the goal of the Kosovans, I think NATO and
the UN have a moral obligation to attack until they've given up their
campaign.  I think we've learned from WW 2.  At least I hope so.

I don't know what the hell we were doing in Vietnam other than fighting
an ideological war.  We have no interests there and never really had.

But Vietnam is not Kosovo or Iraq, and Iraq and Kosovo are not the same
as one another.  To place all acts of US aggression under the same
heading is somewhat naieve and unthinking.  Some reference to the real
situation at hand, please...

and yes, Scottie's post was very much appreciated on that basis.   

Jim 


On Mon, 29 Mar 1999 16:01:28 -0800 "Sean Draine (Exchange)"
<seandr@Exchange.Microsoft.com> writes:
>
>This latest war reflects the rebirth of the myth of US Technological
>Supremacy and Omnipotence. The media reassure us with accounts of 
>impressive
>space-age military gadgetry and equally impressive price tags. We're 
>in the
>midst of a very real revolution in computing technology and a booming
>economy. We've had recent successful military campaigns against a 
>morally
>wanting regime in Iraq. We're feeling pretty good about ourselves.
>
>Vietnam ultimately demonstrated that American omnipotence was an 
>illusion,
>but it also demonstrated how stubbornly some of us cling to it. I 
>think
>we're in for another demonstration of the former. I hope our 
>leadership
>doesn't treat us to another demonstration of the latter. 
>
>-Sean
>
>"Tell them to stop touching my eyeballs!"
>	-Sal Putzman
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: John Touzios [mailto:JTouzios@mwumail.midwestern.edu]
>Sent: Monday, March 29, 1999 8:53 AM
>To: bananafish@lists.nyu.edu
>Subject: america
>
>
>when the u.s. goes to war, what banner does it carry with it.  is 
>there a 
>mythology there that goes to war also, superman or john wayne, or mom 
>and 
>american pie.  i suppose there must be.  but then this might also be 
>constructed on the spot by the government and media for why people 
>have to 
>die, and it's all about power.
>  john
>
>"Man the most complex, intricate and delicately constructed 
>machine of all creation, is the one with which the osteopath 
>must become familiar."  A.T. Still
>
>"Everyone seems to know how useful it is to be useful.
> No one seems to know how useful it is to be useless."
>                           Chuang Tzu
>

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