Re: Lolita
blah b b blah (jrovira@juno.com)
Sat, 13 Mar 1999 21:06:21 -0500 (EST)
Ah, what I'm complaining about here is the very perception that it's
leftist to support freedom of expression and rightist to oppose freedom
of expression. My point was that both sides restrict freedom of
expression equally. Just for different reasons. The thing is, the only
people who ever hit the News are the Falwells and the Christian Coalition
(if that teletubby really were gay, he'd know that red sweater doesn't
match that purple purse).
I mean, REALLY, it was a bunch of priggish puritans (or their
descendants) that came up with the idea of freedom of speech as a
fundamental right, wasn't it?
I get equally frustrated with my right wing friends when they can't see
the strengths of the point of view of the left. Myopia is what's
frustrating to me, not a particular stance on any issue. Let me give you
an example of that from your reply below:
> I am very
>sick & tired of those creeps waving their bibles, the most dangerous
>book in the world, kerosene for ignorant mongoloids everywhere, around
telling
>me what's right & what's wrong.
You're complaining about one group exercising their freedom of expression
on the one hand, then complaining about their complaints about someone
else's freedom of expression on the other. I'm sorry, but I don't see
how you're any different from the people you're complaining about. Would
you push to restrict government funds for artists whose work expressed
the sentiments of those "Creeps waving their bibles"?
Don't give me a knee jerk, "No, of course not." I'll give you the
benefit of the doubt and say you wouldn't, but in reality you wouldn't
know because they're NOT getting any money anyhow. What does that say?
Whose freedom of expression is really being restricted, then? At least
the Mapplethorpes **do** get funding. (and yes, I have seen his work,
and yes, it is artistically remarkable, and yes, it is pornographic in
content too).
(as an aside, at least two people have "been inspired" by Catcher in the
Rye to commit crimes. To me, that's not a reflection of the meaning of
the book, but the unstability of the people reading it. I'd apply that
to other books too, even the Bible)
There's the text of a talk given by a Dr. Denicola (left leaning himself)
on one of the websites I maintain that documents this phenomena pretty
well--that is, the attempt to restrict freedom of expression by the left
and the right in America. He points out that leftist ideologues are just
as intolerant as fundamentalists, and from my experience on college
campuses that's pretty well true. I don't remember the URL for that
particular document, though, I'll have to look it up.
Marxism is the opiate of herd.
Jim
"The written word is a power of such magnitude that only pedants would
try to reduce it to rules. Or the French."
--F.K.
On Sat, 13 Mar 1999 12:57:10 -0500 (EST) Pierrot65@aol.com writes:
>Jim --
>
> I'm sorry, but I didn't get your post at all. Were you saying
>that it is
>necessarily "leftist" to support freedom of expression? No.
> Listen, I don't want to get into politics here or elsewhere
>any more than you
>do. Your last post gave me the impression that we couldn't have a
>reasonable
>discussion about morality either (not your fault, I mean, we just
>wouldn't
>agree). But that post also gave me the impression that that was
>something you
>just wanted to say, "seeming" to me to come from some sort of
>frustration with
>the uplifting of the left by the art/culture world to the absolute
>detriment
>of the right; frustration with the attitude that the right had no
>redeemable
>qualities in post-liberalized society; frustration at polarization.
>That is
>just the impression I got and I have no reason to criticize that.
> BUT, as that has nothing whatsoever to do with my thoughts
>concerning Lolita
>(I am neither right nor left nor center) I will respectfully withdraw
>from
>this particular discussion until your chain has run its course. (As
>usual, I
>meant no condescension.)
>(But just for the record, the same problem DOES NOT exist on the left
>as on
>the right, that is just not true -- but it is also not my point. I was
>not
>stressing the conservatism of the right, but specifically the
>religious
>righteousness of that faction, which happens to sit on the right. I am
>very
>sick & tired of those creeps waving their bibles, the most dangerous
>book in
>the world, kerosene for ignorant mongoloids everywhere, around telling
>me
>what's right & what's wrong. And despite all appearances to the
>contrary, I
>was not suggesting that everyone who reads the bible is an ignorant
>mongoloid.)
>
>rick
>
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